Saxophone Forum


by aramo25
(13 posts)
8 years ago

important question about soprano repading..

Hey guys i finally found a site which is full of experiances sax player so i am in desperate need of your help... well i have a Maxtone Soprano and i just took it back from repading.I found it very wierd that the pads dont even have the circular resonators attached to the middle of them ! Is that normal or there should be resonators? My second question is that i find it very different playing the instrument than i first did and im coming up with wierd annoying voices especially when playin the G-key..The man who owns the repair shop said that i should just give it some time because a saxaphone needs some time to get back to its old tune after repading it... i would appreciate your help ... thanks Aram

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  1. by kneejerk52
    (397 posts)

    8 years ago

    Re: important question about soprano repading..

    resonators are not completly nessecsarry, but help the overall projection of the sound as i understand it. did this "tech" just pad or did he also do the set up and check for leaks? it should play great if done properly. unless it sucked to begin with. the timing with the g key is usually hard to get correct for me. i let someone good at it do it. back to it's old tune????? would like to know what he means by that.

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    1. by aramo25
      (13 posts)

      8 years ago

      Re: important question about soprano repading..

      well he did set it up and checked it for leaks.. but i guess he has done all the job wrong.. the notes are coming out sharp to me and its even harder to play it... im using my same embouchure but finding it harder to produce the sound i used to play before repading it.. i guess he messed up with it pretty bad im so angry about that... what he means by back to its old tune (he's talking about the quality and clearness of sound produced).. im confused what do u think?

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      1. by johnsonfromwisconsin
        (767 posts)

        8 years ago

        Re: important question about soprano repading..

        Hi Aramo, I don't wish to be indignant toward your repair guy, but really, no horn should play better than the instant it leaves the repair man's bench. But here's a couple of things to note: Horns play just fine without resonators, but they tend to play a little darker with more soft material (pad leather) to absorb the higher overtones. Some people prefer this sort of thing. Good technicians should understand that resonator presence can alter response and tone to a degree. As for playing out of tune. It's possible he messed something up. It's also possible he's really an astute technician and player who discovered the horn is wildly out of tune to begin with and adjusted it's voicing properly. That remains a possibility given that Maxtones are not considered great instruments. If that's the case, then you learned to accomodate your soprano's bad tuning and when he fixed it, such accomodations become obsolete. However, this phrase makes me think he's not that competent: The man who owns the repair shop said that i should just give it some time because a saxaphone needs some time to get back to its old tune after repading it... That's really poor reasoning to me, unless the customer is the problem. To me it sounds like there is one or more leaks somewhere in the upper stack. -My opinion as an amature repairman.

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        1. by Sax Mom
          (964 posts)

          8 years ago

          Re: important question about soprano repading..

          I've never examined a Maxtone, so what I'm offering are guesses, based on the science of sound. If the original horn had pads with "domed" resonators, and the new pads have no resonators, the horn will play out of tune, since the size of the sound chamber has been slightly altered. Do you know anyone else that plays a soprano saxophone? If so, you could ask that person to play yours and give you an opinion as to the intonation. It could be that you learned to accomodate previous problems and will have to relearn the lip work, as Johnson suggested. All soprano saxophones are somewhat more difficult than other saxophones to play in tune, and much is the responsibility of the player. What I've heard of the Maxtone has not been good, but a horn should never play worse when it returns from the repair shop than when it went in. Good luck!

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        2. by aramo25
          (13 posts)

          8 years ago

          Re: important question about soprano repading..

          dear johnsonfromwisconsin and Sax Mom, You've both been very helpful to me i should thank you from the buttom of my heart.. I retook the Sax to the repair man and he checked it agian for leaks and he found some as you both suggested. Now i replaced my Selmer S80 C* Mouthpiece with PONZOL (gold plated) and theres a big difference in sound although it is much harder to play.. Have you guys heard of this mouthpiece or do you know anyone who had experiance with it? Thank you..

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        3. by johnsonfromwisconsin
          (767 posts)

          8 years ago

          Re: important question about soprano repading..

          Aramo, Glad your technician was able to make it right. I would guess the Ponzol has a lot more open facing than the C*, therefore is a lot harder to play. Try it with softer reeds to see what happens.

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        4. by Tbone
          (120 posts)

          8 years ago

          Re: important question about soprano repading..

          "If the original horn had pads with "domed" resonators, and the new pads have no resonators, the horn will play out of tune, since the size of the sound chamber has been slightly altered." This is not true. If a competent tech properly addresses the sax's tuning on re-assembly the potential issues are corrected. If the dome vs. no dome made that much difference then dressing the toneholes to level them would also render a sax unplayable. What the dome changes is the effective opening of the tonehole. In general going from domes to flats or no reso usually requires the keys to be lowered slightly. Key word is usually. There are always exceptions.

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        5. by Sax Mom
          (964 posts)

          8 years ago

          Re: important question about soprano repading..

          '" 'If the original horn had pads with "domed" resonators, and the new pads have no resonators, the horn will play out of tune, since the size of the sound chamber has been slightly altered.' " "This is not true. If a competent tech properly addresses the sax's tuning on re-assembly... What the dome changes is the effective opening of the tonehole. In general going from domes to flats or no reso usually requires the keys to be lowered slightly. Key word is usually. There are always exceptions." As you noted, when the repair technician is competant, the horn would be readjusted to make up for the difference when going from domed resonators to no resonators (or flats). However, in this case, the returned horn did not play in tune, and was subsequently found to suffer from some leaks. This being the case, it appears as if the technician did not even play the horn after the repad, or he would have discovered the leaks before returning the horn to the customer. I did not mean to imply that a horn designed with domed resonators could not be made to play in tune without such resonators, just that a simple repad without attention to this detail could be a problem for the intonation of the horn. Thank you for pointing out my omission.

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        6. by Tbone
          (120 posts)

          8 years ago

          Re: important question about soprano repading..

          Sax Mom, I guess I missed the point that you were talking in the specific sense. I read it as a general observation and replied as such. I wasn't trying to call you out or anything so, "sorry if I sounded that way". In my shop there's no such thing as a simple repad. Horns simply are not allowed to leave with leaks and/or improper intonation. I feel that when a horn leaves the shop it should play the best it can possibly play and the best it has ever played. Anything short of that and I shouldn't get paid. JMHO

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        7. by jamterry
          (573 posts)

          8 years ago

          Re: important question about soprano repading..

          Sax Mom has very valuable input in these forums. What she said makes sense to me. The no simple repad is hilarious because it is followed by simply not allowed to leave. It would have been cute if you said not allowed to leave simple. :)

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        8. by Tbone
          (120 posts)

          8 years ago

          Re: important question about soprano repading..

          Yes Sax Mom does has very valuable input in these forums. Unfortunately the same can not be said about certain others who's only agendas seem to be personal attacks and the insighting of anger and hatred. The fact that these forums allow everyone to express their opinions is a good thing. Unfortunately, there's no way to filter out the immature nonsense posts. Sax Mom, I do look foward to further debates with you. Rational discussion is quite enjoyable!

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        9. by Sax Mom
          (964 posts)

          8 years ago

          Re: important question about soprano repading..

          Why, that's a wonderful thing to read upon my return from vacation. Thank you (both)!

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