Saxophone Forum


by mrd
(137 posts)
10 years ago

What's the difference between Super Action 80 SERIES I AND SERIES II

I've not played either but can anyone clarify the differences between the two series.. Fingering/sound/age/etc.. Thanks again Guys

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  1. by west
    (242 posts)

    10 years ago

    Re: What's the difference between Super Action 80 SERIES I AND SERIES II

    One of them is belive it or not,....................................................a series 1, while the other, and be careful, this may shock and amaze you beyond all recognition, is in reality.......................................................A SERIES 2! I actually don't know the difference, but it might have something to do with the positioning of the keys.

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    1. by mrd
      (137 posts)

      10 years ago

      Super Action 80 SERIES I AND SERIES II/Weltklang Markneukirchen Klingenthal

      Well, maybe someone knows. Also, what about the Weltklang Markneukirchen Klingenthal Tenor. I have seen one that looks pristine with a high F# key, but I don't know how these sound. There is no way to try all these horns so reputation from you guys is the only way to begin a judgement. Wait to hear.

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      1. by SaxMan88
        (318 posts)

        10 years ago

        Re: Super Action 80 SERIES I AND SERIES II/Weltklang Markneukirchen Klingenthal

        There is no such thing as a Series I. Unless of course you are just referring to the plain ol' Super Action 80 in which case it is dumb to call it a Series I (it's not marked on the bell as that, therefore the name cannot exist). I've never played a Series II, but I did play a SA80...very nice. Ergonomically (how the keys fit into your hand) it was wonderful. It was my band director's tenor and I had to play it for numerous rehersals and two concerts. Only petpeeve I have with it was that I got a lot of backpressure when I blew B and all the way down. But that could have been a bad mouthpiece/reed/ligiature setup as well. I'd get one if I could. Wetlklang? What the? Wow. Yea, ima have to look that up. Never even heard of it.

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        1. by mrd
          (137 posts)

          10 years ago

          1948 Super Action???

          I found this in decent condition, but don't know anything about it. Can anyone tell me how this 1948 Super Action compares to any of the Selmers from then on?? What is the fingering/Action like, sound,, etc. Would be appreciated. Thank you

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        2. by definition
          (963 posts)

          10 years ago

          Re: 1948 Super Action???

          There is no such thing as a 1948 Super Action. That horn is either a Balanced Action, or a Super Balanced Action

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        3. by mrd
          (137 posts)

          10 years ago

          1948 Super Balanced Action???

          You are right, it is the Balanced Action as of 1948 with the serial number I have. So, can you give me some definitive input on these. Thanks again.

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        4. by west
          (242 posts)

          10 years ago

          Re: 1948 Super Balanced Action???

          Saxman88- I would have to disagree with you. There is a series one, and though they might not have engraved it on the bell, they would never have been able to get to series two had they not considered a previous model sax a series one. In essence, they are real and it does exist. Man I love logic.

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        5. by SaxMan88
          (318 posts)

          10 years ago

          Re: 1948 Super Balanced Action???

          Oh all right West, ya got me, ya got me pardner, I'm bleedin, I'm goin down *laughs*. I just never thought that they would call the SA80 a SA80 Series I. Sorry for the confusion.

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        6. by west
          (242 posts)

          10 years ago

          Re: 1948 Super Balanced Action???

          It don't matter. I just like to turn things around and use logic.

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      2. by mrd
        (137 posts)

        10 years ago

        Weltklang Markneukirchen Klingenthal

        It was made by Keilwerth in Germany in the 80's. The horn is nickel plated with a High F# key. I am told the action is specially arranged for easier useage. I just don't know anything more although I did find information on the net, just not about if I would like its sound.

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      3. by connsaxman_jim
        (2336 posts)

        10 years ago

        Re: Weltklang Markneukirchen Klingenthal

        The Selmer Balanced Action or SBA was the horn that predated the Mark VI. I own a 1952 model. They play very well. The Super Action 80 is an updated version of the Balanced action. The Super Action 80 Series II is an updated version of the Super Action 80. I'm not sure what all the differences are, but the later 2 are based on the original SBA.

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      4. by mrd
        (137 posts)

        10 years ago

        connsaxman

        Thanks for the info There is one that came up on ebay that looks like it is in perfect condition with a Selmer clarinet inside as well. Seller states from an estate sale. It started at $9, and in two hours is over 2000. However just for your curiousity, you might want to look at its condition. I guess it is unusual.. You know, closet horns as they are. I can't afford that much so I guess I will continue to look for something more affordable.

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      5. by SaxMan88
        (318 posts)

        10 years ago

        Re: connsaxman

        Affordable=Selmer LaVoix I've mentioned this horn a lot and have yet not to recommend it. Then again I have yet to play it either *laughs*. It's only $1,799 off WWBW (used to be $300 cheaper, then they jacked the price...I 'got it' when it was cheaper *grins*). I'd definetely check it out. The pic on the website of the tenor is not an accurate pic. If you look up the alto version of the LaVoix, you'll see an accurate picture.

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      6. by mrd
        (137 posts)

        10 years ago

        Re: connsaxman

        Thanks, I will. But certainly you would recommend a Super Action Series II over that I assume? Also, I am looking at a Yamaha 61. Ponzol said he thought that was the most overlooked pro horn and loves it. So, once again, your opinions I await as I respect them. Dan the Man (As they called me in High School, some 43 years ago)!!@!!!

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      7. by SaxMan88
        (318 posts)

        10 years ago

        Re: connsaxman

        Yes, I would. Only because I don't think the LaVoix is made in Paris, as the SA80 Series II is. I think the ones made in Paris might be of slightly better quality. Actually, if I had to get a new horn, and I didn't have a budget, I'd either find a vintage Mark VI or get a Reference 54 (both Selmer). Sadly, I do have a budget that I have to conform to, otherwise I would have had a Mark VI by now. I've heard good things about Yamaha too. But it's not a Selmer. Then again, it's not a vintage Conn either (that wasn't directed at anybody inpeticular *winks*). Good luck!

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      8. by connsaxman_jim
        (2336 posts)

        10 years ago

        Re: connsaxman

        I'd be leary of the Selmer LaVoix from everything I've read. I can guarantee you that the horn is NOT made in Paris. I tried to get some information on where it was read, and wouldn't you know, Selmer doesn't want to say! My guess is that the LaVoix is a LeBlanc made in Taiwan, sold under the Selmer name. The name LaVoix along with mention of the Selmer Paris mouthpiece that is included is to fool you into thinking that this is a French made Selmer, but it isn't! It may be a decent horn, but for the cost? I'd DEFINATELY buy a Yamaha over a LaVoix!

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      9. by connsaxman_jim
        (2336 posts)

        10 years ago

        Re: connsaxman

        A vintage Selmer like an SBA in good condition will bring $3500 or more usually. Honestly, I don't know why/ Sure they play nice, but I prefer my Conn 6M to the Selmer SBA. The action on the Selmer is a little nicer, but the Conn just has an incredible tone, and it plays so easy. Are you looking for an alto or a tenor?

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      10. by mrd
        (137 posts)

        10 years ago

        Re: connsaxman

        I am looking for a Tenor. I have an offer from someone to sell his 1982 SBA for around 1500. It is 98% perfect as I have some pictures of it. Is has been unplayed since 2000. So, for the 1500, I feel that maybe that is the best deal. Otherwise, the Yamaha 61 I hope to be below 1000. Once again, I am going by intuition. If you want to talk on the phone, which would be great, email me and we can share phone numbers at mrdb@adelphia.net. And again, thanks for your time, courtesy, and thoughts. Danny

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      11. by SaxMan88
        (318 posts)

        10 years ago

        Re: connsaxman

        I just sent ya an email

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      12. by connsaxman_jim
        (2336 posts)

        10 years ago

        Re: connsaxman

        1982 would be a Super Action 80. As long as the horn is in good condition, $1500 is a good price. It's a nice tenor. I prefer the new YTS 62 over the 61, but the 61 is a good horn. I just think they sound a little tinny. I've seen some nice Conn 10M's for less than $1800 on ebay also.

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      13. by mrd
        (137 posts)

        10 years ago

        Re: connsaxman

        The man selling it said it was a Series II. That's all I know however he hasn't returned my call yet, so who knows??

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      14. by johnsonfromwisconsin
        (767 posts)

        10 years ago

        Re: connsaxman

        The LaVoix is not Manufactured in France. It's made in Taiwan. The rumour-mill has it that it's design is similar or identical to the Antigua Winds Power-Bell series. This may or may not be true.

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      15. by connsaxman_jim
        (2336 posts)

        10 years ago

        Re: connsaxman

        That's what I suspected; Taiwan. Selmer bought one of the factories over there recently. I heard they bought out Jupiter, but I haven't seen anything to support that.

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      16. by johnsonfromwisconsin
        (767 posts)

        10 years ago

        Re: connsaxman

        I know Selmer aquired the Music Group which owns leblanc, Boosey and Hawkes, as well as Keilwerth I think (I hope I'm not right about Keilwerth). I'm not sure if they own Jupiter or Antigua winds. I'm certain they dont' own both of them. Anyway, Selmer's aquisition worries me because Antigua and Jupiter have made huge strides in quality and manufacturing to produce horns that are both good and inexpensive. Selmer has a history of buying things out and letting quality and design slide so it couldn't reasonably compete with it's lucrative line of French Made instruments.

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      17. by SaxMan88
        (318 posts)

        10 years ago

        Re: connsaxman

        Well, I suspected it wasn't made in France when wwbw listed it as Selmer USA. Oh well. I might just have to pick me up a Mark VI down the road. LaVoix for now. I'm sending out the order tonite. Cross yer fingers guys!

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      18. by mrd
        (137 posts)

        10 years ago

        Final Question on This

        OK. Thanks guys. If you were trying to be objective about value, if the Yamaha 61 were half of what the 1986 SBA was, which would you choose. Remembering that I want quick action right now as a priority, but certainly don't want to hate the sound. Would I just be better off paying as little as I can now and if I could afford it later on, consider trying the 54, or whatever when money isn't a factor?? Hope you guys can try to objective on this one. Thanks a whole bunch for all of your help. "Dangerous Dan"

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      19. by johnsonfromwisconsin
        (767 posts)

        10 years ago

        Re: Final Question on This

        a Yamaha 61 or a Superaction 80 for twice what the yamaha costs? For action, I don't think there's going to be a big advantage one way or the other. If price isn't an object, go for the better horn even if it's only 5% better in your estimation. For most of us, price is an issue and I'd have to side with the yamaha. Either way, when you resell, you're likely to get most of either's price back.

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      20. by mrd
        (137 posts)

        10 years ago

        Decision

        It turns out the SBA80 has a 47.... serial number, which puts after 1987, at a Series II.. So, that clinched it. I am buying it for the 1500. It has been in its case since 2000 and checked by a tech. So, for those that are interested, when it arrives, I will let you know how such a long, protracted conflict and decision turned out. (Sounds like a Soap Huh?),.,,

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      21. by SaxMan88
        (318 posts)

        10 years ago

        Re: Decision

        Wow. Congrats. I'm stunned. This is a wonderful end to the perfect sax soap opera *laughs*

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