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Forum » Vintage Saxophones » Question from a new player on a vintage horn!


by Tortuga12
(4 posts)
18 years ago

Question from a new player on a vintage horn!

Ok, so I have an old Conn Transitional tenor that belonged to my grandfather, and I'm trying to learn how to play sax to join a Navy band. (I have a B.A. in music ed, my major inst. is clarinet) I'm having some problems, however. I'm not sure if they are equipment related or not. Any help you can provide would be greatly appreciated!!! 1. The horn is playing very sharp. It is marked with an L, so I don't think it's a high pitch horn. In order to play at 440, the mouthpiece must be almost falling off the instrument! I have several mouthpieces (Meyer 5M, Selmer Soloist D, old Brilhart Ebolin 3*, and an old Dukoff "Bob Dukoff" 6*.), and they all exhibit this characteristic. I'm playing on Mitchell Lurie 3 1/2's right now. (Yes, I know VanDoren is better, but my chops suck at the moment.) The metal Dukoff works the best, but of course is rather loud, and maybe not the best choice for the classical stuff I'm working on right now. 2. A and Bb above the staff are VERY stuffy, and octave jumps are almost impossible. All vents seem to be opening and closing ok, is this a common beginner problem, or should I have the horn checked out. 3. bell noes are very difficult to start, but once I get them going, they sound GREAT! (I love playing bass clarinet for those low tones!) Thanks for your help in advance, and if you have any advice on how to prepare for my upcoming audition, please include that also!

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  2. by landrusax
    (44 posts)
    18 years ago

    Re: Question from a new player on a vintage horn!

    Hello, I will try to help you with some of your questions. The old conns have a neck that is almost too short for modern mouthpieces to play in tune. The mouthpieces back then were longer so it compensated for the problem you have now. I have a 1935 conn baritone that had the same problem with the mouthpiece almost falling off the neck to play in tune. I know a few other people I've talked to have had the same problem. I found an old conn neck and cut off a half inch and had it soldered onto my neck for an extension. This completly solved the problem of the horn playing sharp unless the mouthpiece is precariously placed on the neck. I would take the horn to a technician to get it checked out for your other problems. If a key that is closed the majority of the time (like side Bb, C, or the palm Keys) is leaking, it will throw off the entire horn. Good luck.

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    1. by Dave Dix
      (421 posts)
      18 years ago

      Re: Question from a new player on a vintage horn!

      You could raise the neck in the reciever a bit Dave

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      1. by Radjammin
        (255 posts)
        18 years ago

        Re: Question from a new player on a vintage horn!

        I like Daves Idea, less horns have to die. The area of my old tenor that used to leak was the palm keys. The have the longest keys and I believe to be the most common problem on tenor. They will definately cause an inital sound problem on low tones, below D. Also how are you playing the sax, as my tone has grown over the years I have the flatest tone on the planet now(comment extreme for effect), and no I do not sub tone. I tend to play my sax on puckered lips, having the sax sit on my lower lip puckered out. I get a very bright tone by doing this, check out my recordings on www.vintagehorn.com, but also by doing this my teeth are miles away from the reed, aka, no bighting, aka, no sharpy sharpy. I personaly hate being sharp, I think it's the sign of the lazy musicican. I tune a tade flat and let my ear and lower lip correct the tone. I know flat is easier to hear, but to my ears sharp sounds just as bad.

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        1. by Radjammin
          (255 posts)
          18 years ago

          Re: Question from a new player on a vintage horn!

          One aditional comment, when I say I tune flat, I am pushed in almost the entire way, and I am just then in tune. Also when I say how are you playing it, I mean you are playing it like a sax, not a clarient right? Letting the mouthpiece sit level with your head and tounging with the front of the tounge instead of like a clarinet, at a higher angle and tounging with the tip of your tounge?

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        2. by Tortuga12
          (4 posts)
          18 years ago

          Re: Question from a new player on a vintage horn!

          I am playing with a fairly "proper" embouchure, flat, corners down, etc. The placement of the strap ring makes this a little difficult, but I have been able to compensate.

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        3. by Sax Mom
          (964 posts)
          18 years ago

          Re: Question from a new player on a vintage horn!

          Amen to the raising of the neck. That's what I do on my Conn Tenor. (I just got a vintage mouthpiece for my alto, so I don't have to do that on the alto any more!)

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        4. by connsaxman_jim
          (2336 posts)
          18 years ago

          Re: Question from a new player on a vintage horn!

          Perhaps I should just make a few of these to pass along to my fellow 10M players... I machined a brass ring that is the size of my sax neck. It's about 3/32 of an inch thick. I just slip this ring over the neck, and it holds the neck up 3/32 of an inch above the tenon. You may even be able to find that would work at a hardware store. Just make sure that the ring is thin enough not to interfere with the octave key. You may need to file it down some. The size of the chamber of the mouthpiece makes a big difference also. On a vintage horn, use a mouthpiece with a large, open chamber. Many of the newer style mouthpieces have chambers too small to work with vintage horns.

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        5. by Sax Mom
          (964 posts)
          18 years ago

          Re: Question from a new player on a vintage horn!

          I just raise the neck (about 3/32 inch) and tighten the screw (on my Tenor). It stays there with no brass ring required! I believe the vintage Conn mouthpieces were also slightly smaller where they connect to the neck--mine (the alto) doesn't slide on to the neck as far, and isn't as loose as more modern mouthpieces. Seems odd that they'd have a larger chamber but smaller connecting bore, but that seems to be the case.

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