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by karebear1012
(395 posts)
20 years ago

Where can I buy it?!?!?

I really want a Selmer Reference Alto sax, and my parents said they're willing to pay up to the low $3000s for a new horn (my conductor said I need a pro horn for jazz band this year). I've looked everywhere for a reference that's in that price range, and the lowest I found was 3900, which is a couple hundred too expensive. That was at USA Horn. Where could I find a reference (new, or used in really good condition) that's in my parents' price range?

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  2. by chiamac
    (586 posts)
    20 years ago

    Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

    I wish I had parents like yours...

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    1. by karebear1012
      (395 posts)
      20 years ago

      Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

      lol, my mom majored in music (she plays flute, piano, and she used to play violin and trumpet), so she knows how expensive instrments can get these days.... she also knows for a fact that im gonna keep up with the sax and music in general for the rest of my life.. what type of sax do you have? cya, Kara

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    2. by spida
      (12 posts)
      20 years ago

      Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

      www.nextag.com/Selmer_Musical_Instruments~2726655zSelmerz2,900z0zBftszmainz5-htm" target="other">www.nextag.com/Selmer_Musical_Instruments~2726655zSelmerz2,900z0zBftszmainz5-htm Best I can do with my tiny amount of knowledge. And it's nice that your parents encourage you like that. Good luck to yer!

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      1. by golferguy675
        (600 posts)
        20 years ago

        Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

        Woodwind has a B stock of them or 3 grand even, B means they have a minor cosmetic flaw, and they still have the full warranty and play perfectly. The regular ones are 3700. Go to wwbw.com

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        1. by The_MarkVI
          (80 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          Hey have you even tried the sax yet? The reference may not be for you. Try other brands. Hey you may even like the yamaha better (and save some money for a mouthpiece or something. And i wouldnt reccomend buying a sax from wwbw i hear complaints about them

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        2. by golferguy675
          (600 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          Yeah, the complaints are about shipping of the horns, it's better just to drive there and buy them, it's usually worth the difference. Everything else is fine though, I order parts and other things from them all of the time. Also, for a ref, you could buy a Yanagisawa A9930 at WWBW. It's got a SOLID silver neck and body, and a gold lacquer brass bell and lacquered keywork. That sax is a monster.

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        3. by SaxMan
          (559 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          we have them at the shop I work at for less than 3900, and I can garauntee you that there is nothing wrong with it. the only thing is shipping where things can go out of adjustment due to the temperature changes. Interested?

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        4. by golferguy675
          (600 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          See, this is the problem with what I like to call "selmer snobs". I'm not calling anyone one, but what I'm saying is people would pay that just for the name and the rep of the 54 Mark VI. Personally, I don't really like the refs a whole lot. I own one, but only because I payed about a third of the price at the NAM conference. I would never pay the full 3800 , when for 37500, you could buy a sax twice as good; the A9930. The ref is not even comparible to it.

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        5. by karebear1012
          (395 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          yeah, i've heard of selmer snobs... there's a reference at the place where i take sax lessons, and i really like it, but it costs too much. saxman, if the reference you know about is in the low 3s, i'd definately be interested. Where are you from? maybe i'd be able to go there.. i've tried a ton of horns, and the ref is my favorite so far. i liked the yanigasawas i tried too though. thanks, Kara

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        6. by golferguy675
          (600 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          He's in Alaska, don't bother. The lowest I've seen is 3750

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        7. by SaxMan
          (559 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          I am with the horndoctor in alaska, like golfer said. I quoted someone else the other day, and I am pretty sure it was less than 3750, but cant remember. If you are going to get one that doesn't have any problems, you are going to pay in the mid 3's, or you are going to buy a demo horn. Mark also has one - he is in saint louis - he wants 3750 I beleive. But I mean, if you are going to spend over 3 grand on a horn, whats few hundred on a horn that is the way it is supposed to be? If it were me, there is no way I would ever buy anything from a mass internet retailer - no matter how cheap it is. If it were me, I would find a horn from a real shop (as in one with technicians and real advice.) There are 4 shops that I can think of right off hand - the one I work at - the one caleb works at, saxquest, and marshwoodwinds. I am in alaska - caleb's is in minnesota, saxquest is in saint louis, and marsh woodwinds is somewhere on the east coast. Your parents are forking out a LOT of money for you, don't waste it on a less than perfect horn - take what they have and pay the rest that you need.

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        8. by golferguy675
          (600 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          Too bad you didn't hook up with this forum earlier. I sold a brand new ref for 2700. I got two of them for 3500 if I'm remembering the price right, so I sold the other one low and still made a good profit. Also, before you buy something pricey like that, rtry EVERYTHING out, because there's nothing like forking out 3 grand or more and finding one you wish you had gotten. Try Yamaha customs and the A9930, and the Series 2, which I find comparable to the ref. Finding a III that can really play and scream is 1 in a million. The ones I've played were very resistant and stuffy, but I know a few people that have lucked out. So don't make the mistake of having you mind set on one sax, and not trying them all first.

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        9. by karebear1012
          (395 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          yeah, so far i've tried out 3 keilwerths, the unlaquered yamaha Z (which i also liked), yamaha EX, selmer series III and II (i'm currently borrowing a series III from the school for my district auditions, but I don't really like it so far..), and a couple yanigasawas. I also tried out the Selmer that was made before the Mark IV (a premium or something?), but it didn't play, so the woodwind specialist at Rayburns said he'd fix that up if i ever wanted to buy it. my favorite horn so far has been the reference. are there any other brands i should try out? is jupiter any good? when i was searching for a new trumpet, i was warned many times to NOT buy a jupiter, but they may have great alto saxophones.... any ideas? Thanks, Kara

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        10. by The_MarkVI
          (80 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          I wouldnt recomend the jupiter for a few reasons. 1. The top model is a ..... of a hard job to clean. 2. the keys start to do their own things. 3. they dont sound too great. Hey have you played a rampone&cazzini. I hear they are the new greatest things out there. try www.saxforte.com

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        11. by SaxMan
          (559 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          THe jupiter is crap. combine terrible tunign with an overly bright tone, and you have a jupiter - they also put those BS sticky back pads in so the manufacturing costs stay low. What does that mean? when you go in for an adjusmtnet, your getting an entire repad - its impossible to float a sticky back pad. And I have a theory on those pads, I think to make them work, they use over soft brass on the keys so that the damn thing feels like a bass - when the keys flex, it caters to the tone hole. And when they flex, they slow you down considerably, and will also contribute to poor playing - a lot of the times, a sax plays good because the pad hits in the EXACT same spot every single time - this is impossible with pathetically soft keys - those soft keys will also wear faster than a standard sax and you will need to lubricate it more often than a yamaha. Or they just hope the pads seal the tone holes and the keys are just soft to be cheap.

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        12. by karebear1012
          (395 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          ok thanks...i wont even bother trying one. cya, Kara

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        13. by tenor562
          (297 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          yea, they do stink compared to the references. You'd be totally dissappointed.

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        14. by karebear1012
          (395 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          yeah...i'm looking for some alternatives in case i can't find a reference in the low 3000s. my parents said this horn has to last me the rest of my life, unless i turn pro, but i'm only almost 14....so it'll be a while. i really didn't like the series III, so i might end up with a yanigasawa, which i liked. i got a yamaha trumpet in 5th grade, and i still have it, and it plays great..i'm not saying that goes for alto saxophones too, but it definately makes yamaha look good in my eyes. I liked the unlaquered Z. so i had a football game yesterday (i'm in da marching band), and it was an away game...we almost got booed off the field lol. it was a christian school and all the moms of the fb players were cussing at us and stuff. that's pretty bad, but it was so funny lol. no jazz band this week..... cya, Kara

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        15. by karebear1012
          (395 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          hey, sorry this is kinda random..but if you have a soprano sax, what type of reeds do you use?? thanks, Kara

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        16. by The_MarkVI
          (80 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          on my soprano i use la voz and vandoren V16's MH and 3

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        17. by SelmerParisPassion
          (59 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          Where do you live, I might have competition, lol! I reccomend www.sax-forte.com Excellent prices from a trustworthy dealer. Although, I'd say stick with a Selmer Serie III. The Reference may be newer, but it's too nasal to me. But, it changes from player to player. Christie J

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        18. by karebear1012
          (395 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          i'm from MA. doubt i'll be any competition to you lol. im better at trumpet. yeah, i tried a series III, but i didn't really like it...this may sound really cheesey, but my trumpet teacher always tells me that when you play the right instrument, you just know it's the right one (kinda like love i guess?)... what do you know about saxophones.co.uk ? they have the ref in my price range!!! are they any good? thanks, Kara

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        19. by The_MarkVI
          (80 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          no saxophone.co.uk is BAD first u ship overseas which takes a while and its in euros so it is more expensive and shipping is a biznatch

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        20. by karebear1012
          (395 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          are you sure? i read somewhere that a US $ is roughly .8 Euros...so that would make the 2,126 E reference about 2,645 US dollars right? Then shipping would make it about $2,745. I dunno..i reaaally want a reference=\ cya, Kara

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        21. by karebear1012
          (395 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          so i just got off the phone with SaxForte.. we went over what tones I like in a horn, what brands i've tried, and prices. so now i'm lookin at the yanigasawas...any ideas on models? what's the difference between each one? cya, Kara

          Reply To Post


        22. by golferguy675
          (600 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          Definetly try the A9930. It's available at WWBW for somewhere in the 3 grand range. Everywhere else, it's 4 or 5 grand.

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        23. by karebear1012
          (395 posts)
          20 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          Okie...thanks for all your help! I've got marching band tonight...i'm so fed up with all the guys seeing me as that GIRL who plays the trumpet and sax, and not that MUSICIAN that plays the trumpet and sax. hopefully that will change... cya, Kara

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        24. by connsaxman_jim
          (2336 posts)
          19 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          Really? A Yanagisawa A 9930 for around $3,000? I'll have to check into that. I've never really been a big Yanagisawa fan. I've always kinda looked down on the Asian horns. I just recently tried an A9930, and WOW!!! What a fantastic horn! It takes a lot to impress me, but this horn certainly did. I play mostly tenor. For the style of music I play, a Yanagisawa or a Selmer just doesn't have the sound I'm looking for. I play a lot of blues, jazz, funk, and some old 50's and 60's rock and roll. The Conn 10M is the ultimate horn for what I do. As for new tenors, a Keilwerth SX-90 has the best sound for what I play. Although both saxophones, altos and tenors are completely different. Different sound, different feel, and the emboscher is very different. I think it's much harder to play an alto in tune than a tenor. It is very important that the alto be set up properly and be in good condition to play well and to play in tune. I have a few altos. the oldest a 1908 Conn Wonder. I don't play it except for occasionally at home, and I played it at a vintage musical instruments show. It's just too old, too touchy, and the intonation isn't the greatest. I have a 1922 Conn New Wonder, which I don't play much either. The intonation is better than the Wonder, but it's still a little too antique to gig with. I recently finished restoring a 1927 New Wonder series II Chu Berry alto. this horn is considerably better than the older models. I have a 1950 Conn 6M alto that I really like. It plays like a dream, it's built like a tank, and it sounds very good. It also matches my 10M, and the 2 ladies look very pretty in the stand together. On alto, I play more contemporary music, and I prefer a smoother, silky, more seductive tone. I have a vintage Selmer SBA which sounds pretty good. I've been thinking about buying either a Reference or a Series III, and now I'm looking seriously at an A9930. I guess my deciding factor will be the price.

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        25. by Roccosm
          (113 posts)
          18 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          Hi jim, I replyed to an article You had wrotr here about the Conn, serial number's My Friend gave me a 1932 Conn alto ser. num 246?? but it plays great, under the ser num there is a letter L which someone told me it mean's low pitch, but it has have a little intonation issue's in the High open key range, but the mellow tone of the horn is great and I play it alot with a combo of Mine..what do You think of the Ramponi&cazzini Horn's, I have heard some good thing's but an very curious about them,,,I am Italian, not that it matter's but I was interested in there quality..thank You, Rocco

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      2. by GordonGekko
        (27 posts)
        19 years ago

        Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

        Go with what works best for you. There are interest-free arrangements that can be made with many retailers out there. Also, I think it's awesome that you are playing music, but wow, a $4,000 horn at 14? You can always upgrade down the road. Stick to it and don't worry about what everybody else says. You are not just that "girl" that plays 2 instruments- you are a musician. If you pursue music for a career, great, I hope you enjoy it. If not, hit the books and get into a profession that enables you to pursue your passion and have plenty of $$$ to buy whatever instrument you want! Regards, GG

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        1. by karebear1012
          (395 posts)
          19 years ago

          Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

          yeah, my director told me i need a really good pro horn now...and my parents dont really want to spend so much money on an inter. horn AND a pro horn... Thanks 4 da help! Kara

          Reply To Post


          1. by tenor562
            (297 posts)
            19 years ago

            Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

            wow, if my band director told my parents that I needed a 3000 dollar horn, they'd think he was crazy. They thought he was crazy when he told them that they should spend at least 1000 to get a good quality working horn. Luckily, I ended up with a beautiful 62II. it took a year to convince them, though. I'd go for the yanis, if you don't like yamahas. Unfortunately, I'm not a selmer fan. I was looking at my prized WWBW magazine, ( i got 2!) and I saw the Keilwerth Shadows, how much are those? They sound like their pretty awesome. I do like Yamahas though.... -tenor562

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            1. by jazzfool132
              (144 posts)
              19 years ago

              Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

              karebear1012, how did your search for the yani go? i hope it ends happily... and i wish i had musical parents..lol...that would spend 4k on an instrument good luck, jazzfool132

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            2. by karebear1012
              (395 posts)
              19 years ago

              Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

              i'm thinking of buying a keilwerth now... any ideas? but yeah, i love having a musical mom (my dad isn't at all musical, but he is really supportive). my sis and 2 brothers are also getting into music which is awesome. we currently have a drumset, piano, 3 guitars, a trumpet, soprano sax, alto sax, clarinet, flute, piccolo, violin, and a bunch of harmonicas lying around, so we definately have our portion of music lol. i love it though.

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            3. by jazzfool132
              (144 posts)
              19 years ago

              Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

              nice

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            4. by jazzfool132
              (144 posts)
              19 years ago

              Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

              keilwerth.. my friend has an intermediate level black lacquer sax. i tried it out a couple of times. keys action is pretty slow but the higher register intonation is wonderful! that is the EX-90 i believe. the pro model however (SX-90) is over a grand more and has the same body shape. it depends on ur preference. hope this helps

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            5. by karebear1012
              (395 posts)
              19 years ago

              Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

              was that the one with rolled tone holes? i dunno if that's any good so i was just asking around. what do the rolled tone holes do? i was thinking of getting the SX-90 silver nickel...what dyou think? thanks! Kara

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            6. by sax_maniac
              (984 posts)
              19 years ago

              Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

              SX-90R has rolled tone holes. Same design as the SX-90 except for the soldered on tone hole rings that give the top of the tone hole a broader profile where it meets the pad. As these tone holes do not "cut" into pads nearly as much as regular drawn tone holes, it is imperative that the top of the hole and accompanying ring are near perfectly level or it will be difficult to get a good pad seat. Add that the pad setting and pad cup alignment must be dead on and level as well. Aside from rolled tone holes making tone hole leveling an absolute nightmare if it's not perfect from the factory, the only sound difference is that you can achieve certain effects by partially closing a pad (bending or transitioning notes). With rolled tone holes, you can achieve a more gradual effect, but the difference is rather subjective and most people don't monkey with the details consciously anyways. The old Keilwerths and Conns were made with true rolled tone holes where the top of the drawn tonehole was actually rolled over to form the ring. The modern equivalent is soldered on to achieve the same end design in a different manner. I've reviewed that website that poops all over Keilwerth's modern tone hole rings. There's a lot of truth to the risks proposed there. Whether the risks are as common or extreme as he portrays is his word against anyone else's. Definitely worth taking your leak light to fully review a RTH horn before buying it whether it's a Keilwerth or an old Conn. Drawn toneholes are certainly easier to repair and level if damaged or pitted. Another issue to consider is pads sticking to the toneholes. With a broader tonehole profile, there's more contact area and a greater risk of pads sticking. Some people drag 2000 grit sandpaper over the tops of their toneholes (pad closed) in case the lacquer that's there encourages sticking. I think Keilwerth pro horns use a special design which prevents this from happening to G#.

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            7. by chiamac
              (586 posts)
              19 years ago

              Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

              2000 grit sandpaper??? you're almost better off using a dollar or some paper... seriously.

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            8. by SaxMan
              (559 posts)
              19 years ago

              Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

              it might have the same grain, but silicon or whatever they use for the abraisive is harder than paper and dollars.

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            9. by jazzfool132
              (144 posts)
              19 years ago

              Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

              dont use garnet abrasives..itll tear up the horn!

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            10. by and all that jazzzzzzzzzzzzz!
              (1 post)
              19 years ago

              Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

              i dunno, but I need help, you see I'm a kind of beginner and i got my sax an all, I just can't find any good music on da internet! Help me plez!

              Reply To Post


          2. by sgt17594
            (31 posts)
            19 years ago

            Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

            Want a pro horn? A lot of pro horn in the market such as Selmer Series II or III, Yamaha 875EX or 82Z, Yanagisawa 9930 are the good pro horn! If you really want a "pro horn" . It must be Selmer Mark VI !!! Some (latest) Mark VI in cluding overhurl are below $3000 ! ^_^

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            1. by semipro
              (17 posts)
              19 years ago

              Re: Where can I buy it?!?!?

              Karebear, I have been away for a while and did not see that you were looking for a reference 54 alto. If you are still consodering this horn and do not mind getting your band director involved the answer to your prayers is a company called NEMC. they only sale to band directors and schools. Their price for the referencce is in the low 3ks but your band director has to order it and it has to go to the schools address. Hope this helps you get what you really want.

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