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Forum » General Discussions » i want to upfrade to new alto sax by Skylark (27 posts) 19 years ago i want to upfrade to new alto sax high i am a sophmore in hih school and play in every band we got in he school, but i like jazz thew most and want to continue band into college and hopefully beyond. but i have been using a armstrong for 5 years and want to get a new one that will take me through at least college. and am thinking of buying a cannonball big bell globel, black nickel with silver keys. i played one and loved it it flored me to play it, i also played a selmer and dident lik ethe tone or response as mutch. so could comeone give a opinion of a good one to by, and if the cb is ok the price was 1700 makred to 1400 becuase we were there at the jazz fesetifel for school. Reply To Post [Report Abuse] Report Abuse Web Address * Your Name Your Email Address Comment
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by SaxMan88 (318 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax Selmer. I don't know much about Cannonball, so don't ask me. Maybe you should try some other Selmers. Either that or pick up a Mark VI laughs. Seriously, if you want one that's going to get you through college, Selmer would be my first choice. Now I have to wait for Jim's (connsaxmanjim) opinion on this, but maybe some of his Conn's (10M? Chu Berry? Dunno that much about them, that's why you might want his opinion on them; and I know he hates Selmers laughs) So there, you have two. Selmer and Conn. I've also heard of Yamaha, Allora, and I think that's about it. Reply To Post by karebear1012 (395 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax I'm looking for a new alto sax too (i'm a HS freshman), and in general keilwerth and selmer have been recommended the most to me. Not once have I heard someone tell me to try out a Cannonball.... What type of Selmer did you try? I don't really like the Selmer Series III at all...but i absolutely love the Reference. Try out a Keilwerth SX-90 or SX-90R, and if it's the black with silver you're looking for, the Keilwerth Shadow has that (it also has rolled tone holes i think). Good luck! Reply To Post by Skylark (27 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax it was a selmer mark VII Reply To Post by The_MarkVI (80 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax Ok if u wanna just do high school band, buy the cannonball. But since you want a scholarship and go to college in music, I wouldnt. I wouldnt buy a vintage saxophone espically a Mark VI. I own a Mark VI and all but bringing it to college is too much. And it would be hard to find a repair guy all the time cause vintage instruments tend to break easily then modern horns. Try some of these Selmer- Series II and III (ref. are too expensive) Yanagisawa- A991 Keilwerth- SX-90 and SX-90R and the Shadow Rampone and Cazzani- R1 Jazz model Yamaha- YAS-62II, YAS-875, YAS-875EX, YAS-82Z All these saxs start from about 2,200 and up. Good luck in your saxophone carrer. Reply To Post by karebear1012 (395 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax you didn't like the mark IV? well just because one selmer didn't work for you, you shouldn't give up on all of them. Try a series II, III, or reference (if you've got the money..). I called the guy who works at SaxForte (www.saxforte.com), and he helped me out a lot because we talked about the tone i like and my budget, and he chose out the horns that fit my tastes. Good luck! Reply To Post by YanagisawA-901 (312 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax If you didnt like the tone or response of a mk iv than you dont have the musical knowhow or experience to upgrade to a new horn. a lot of ppl are partial to different horns, but a mk iv is a nice horn. i never see anyone give reference to the yani 901.. its more of an intermediate horn which will definately serve you through highschool and if your skilled through college. i love my 901 and i payd a lil under 1k for it. i got an amazing deal. look at the kielwerth ex 90 maybe.. dont try the sx 90 your not ready for that. dont know much about selmers. vintage conns are very nice. and relatively inexpensive. Reply To Post Yahoo! AIM ICQ by karebear1012 (395 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax why wouldn't he be ready for an SX-90? if you want a horn that's gonna last you through college, i'd say just go for a pro model...the value of intermediate horns usually goes down, if you ever try to sell it. Reply To Post by connsaxman_jim (2336 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax Ok, here's the scoop. Cannonball saxophones are made in Taiwan and their quality is very inconsistant. I wouldn't recommend them. The newer ones are slightly better than the older models, but still, Cannonball saxophones are all talk. Don't believe the hype! It's an intermediate Jupiter quality horn and a good sales pitch! The Selmer Reference horns are nice horns but very over-rated if you want my opinion. So are the Series II and Series III Selmers. The quality is not nearly as good as that of the older Selmers for a PREMIUM price! Don't be a Selmer snob! Most of the AS series Selmers are NOT US made, but also made in Taiwan. I'll let you in on a little hint: Many of these cheaper horns, such as the Keilwerth ST models, the Selmer AS, the Conn 37M and a few others are made by Jupiter in Taiwan. For a new intermediate model horn, there is no better saxophone for the money than the Yamaha 62. They are a GREAT sax! The 475 and the pro model 82Z are also very good horns. For a pro model horn, my favorite would be the Keilwerth SX-90. Again, I would highly consider a Yamaha 82Z also. As for vintage horns, the comments Mark VI made are only true of the very old horns. I wouldn't select anything made before about 1934 if you intend to play it regularly, with a few notable exceptions. Take a Conn M series, a Martin, Kind or Buexcher, if they are in good condition, well maintained and properly set-up initially, they don't require any more adjusting or care than a new horn. If fact, they usually need less frequent adjusting and maintenance and hold together better! This is because of the quality of craftsmenship and better metal and materials used in the vintage horns. I LOVE vintage horns! I play and collect American vintage horns; especially vintage Conn. The vintage horns just have so much character, and a sound that I haven't been able to find in a modern horn. Reply To Post Yahoo! by SaxMan88 (318 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax Whoa! Whoa! He said Mark VII, not IV. Two different horns. Is there sucha thing as the Mark IV? I'd like to see pics of that if anybody can provide info. I've never heard a good thing about the Mark VII; this was Selmer's lame attempt at re-creating the Mark VI, which failed. Jim, what is the Selmer AS? I'm missing something here. Reply To Post by connsaxman_jim (2336 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax the Selmer AS is the current student-intermediate series. I think AS originally stood for American Selmer or American Series. The horns were originally made in the old Buescher factory in Elkhart, Indiana. Now the cheaper AS series horns are made in Taiwan. Reply To Post Yahoo! by SaxMan88 (318 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax Gotcha. Thanx. I was thinking. It's kind of funny how all these companies (CG Conn, Armstrong, Artley, Benge, King, Vincent Bach, Ludwig, and Leblanc) are all under Selmer. I thought of that as being pretty funny. That doesn't leave a WHOLE lot left (Allora, Jupiter, LA Sax, Yamaha, Yanagisawa). I might have missed a few in each category. I find it interesting how half of the instruments put out are Selmer licensees and the rest are independents. Is it sad or a good thing? I don't know. It might be a good thing b/c I like Selmer. But to those who don't, well... Reply To Post by Skylark (27 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax whoa there yani just becuase i diddent like the selmer means im not musical enough, sorry buddy where i come from [in america] srry i misspelled it people are intiteled to there opinions and if i dident like it mdoesent mean im musicly challenged, people are different, there isent 6 billion people ou there like you who beleive that selmeres are the best ya know. Reply To Post by connsaxman_jim (2336 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax Ahhh SaxMan88, now you're beginning to see why I don't like Selmer. Starting with Buescher in 1963, they buy out and desecrate every company they can get their greedy hands on! Selmer wants 2 grades of saxophone: The Selmer Paris, and the JUNK! By the way, Selmer also owns Jupiter and recently purchased Yanigasawa! That's why I now only recommend Keilwerth and Yamaha! Reply To Post Yahoo! by connsaxman_jim (2336 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax I just looked at the Selmer Music group web page and I see no mention of Jupiter, but I was told by a tech friend that Jupiter was also purchased by Selmer. I know that Jupiter makes several horns for Selmer and some of the Selmer companies. ! Reply To Post Yahoo! by SaxMan88 (318 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax Well, Jim, some of the stuff isn't junk. Like the Conn24MHF I mentioned that was made by Armstrong when I bought it, I love that horn. I'm sure it's not as nice sounding as a Mark VI or a Series III, but it's holding it's own for me right now. I own an Artley clarinet, that's 20 years old that's doing me quite well. Eh, I guess it's all a matter of opinion. If you like Selmer, great. If you don't, that's not cool. I still never heard of a Mark IV. Could anybody give me info on it? Maybe even possible pics? Reply To Post by karebear1012 (395 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax jeez like youve never made a typo before! Mark VI ... there, ya happy now? gosh. Reply To Post by YanagisawA-901 (312 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax its not a matter of wether or not u have a certain preference. certain horns are just very nice horns, and if you cant produce good tone out of them than your not skilled enough yet. its like saying " maann i have trouble merging onto the highway with my WRX sTi.. " if you cant go fast with a car like that, then you dont know how to drive.. i personally believe the same concept goz with certain horns. if you cant produce a sound out of the horn thats somewhat pleasant, or if you think the sound isnt pleasant than your ears are wrong, or you are wrong thas all im saying.. bbuuttt.. i would try yamahas.. they are nice horns. thier tone and chromatics are almost dull in the fact that their intonation is almost exact. you have a lot of room to work with what kinda tone you want to produce. look at the 62 and the custom Z Reply To Post Yahoo! AIM ICQ by sax_maniac (984 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax I hear Time Warner is looking to acquire UMI, and I think CNN sucks, so I'm sticking with vintage Yani stencils! ;) Reply To Post by sax_maniac (984 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax I like my horns fair and Super Balanced. Reply To Post by SaxMan88 (318 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax karebear1012 wrote: "jeez like youve never made a typo before! Mark VI ... there, ya happy now? gosh." Laughs. Sorry karebear, didn't mean to upset ya. And I really didn't know if there was such a thing as the Mark IV, just wanted to get my sources straight. I agree with what Yani said. Of all horns NOT to like, you had to say it was a Mark VI. What'd I'd do to play one, nonetheless have the chance to own one. Note that most pro players (including but not limited too; Kenny G [if you consider him a pro], David Sanborn, Candy Dulfer, Michael Brecker) all use Mark VI's. Gee...I wonder why? Reply To Post by karebear1012 (395 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax hehe, sorry... Reply To Post by someguy (80 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax Try a Julious Kielwerth. SX90 or SX90R. Reply To Post by Skylark (27 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax well yani, its no that i dident like the sound of the selmer, the fact was i liked the sound of the cannonball just the same, i liked the mellow kind of tone the black laquering gave off, plus i dont hvae the money to buy a 4000 selmer or even 3000 so thats why i bought the cannonball bigbell globel professional edition for 2400 and got a 20% of discount for being at the jazz fest 2 days before. now that thats said i would like to know a good mouth peice thats not hard to play and doesent cost too mutch. Reply To Post by Skylark (27 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax i forgot the price i paid was 1900 or so for th cannonball, it is black nickel plating and gold keys Reply To Post by SaxMan88 (318 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax Skylark wrote: "I liked the mellow kind of tone the black laquering gave off" I hope you just meant the horn that was colored in black lacquer. Lacquer has no effects on sound quality whatsoever. Now of course a silver plated horn, I've heard can be a somewhat pain to tune. But that's b/c it's silver plated; not silver lacquered. You can get the same horn in clear lacquer, gold lacquer, gold or clear engraved, black lacquer, or antiqued lacquer and the horn will sound the same. Obviously, it's only when you start modifying your horn models will you get a change in sound quality (that is before you start screwing around with mouthpieces and reeds and ligiatures) And I myself am kind of in your jam right now. I don't have $4,000 to spend on a Selmer Paris instrument (I drooled when I thought about getting the Selmer Reference 54 Tenor...) but I made do with a Selmer LaVoix, I just ordered it, should be in by the end of April and I'll let ya kno what I think of it. Hey, ya might wanna check it out. $1,500 for the tenor off WWBW and only $1,400 or so for the alto. Nice looking horn with all the Selmer Paris features but it's made in the USA. TTFN. Reply To Post by johnsonfromwisconsin (767 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax jim: ------------------------------------------------- ....recently purchased Yanigasawa! ------------------------------------------------- What makes you think Selmer own Yanagisawa? IIRC, you've (or someone else has) been declaring this for months now but it isn't true. Yanagisawa Inc. owns Yanagisawa. Selmer now owns Leblanc and Leblanc also never has owned Yanagisawa. LeBlanc merely distributed Yanagisawa goods to the United States market, and they continue to do so under Selmer ownership. Yanagisawa continues to be an independent manufacturer. Reply To Post by sax_maniac (984 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax That would explain why Selmer has little elves that mess up all the good Yanis before they get to the stores in the U.S. :) Reply To Post by KCSaxGal (46 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax I see it's too late as you have already purchased a horn. I was going to recommend the Yamaha 62II. As for mouthpiece... in your price range I would recommend a Meyer. Reply To Post by Skylark (27 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax ya alot of people recomend meyers should i get metel or a differnt type Reply To Post by SaxMan88 (318 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax Ya really shouldn't get metal. Hard rubber or plastic is the best way to go if you're starting out on sax. The metal requires a super-tight ombeshure or you sound like ****. I wouldn't recommend it. Meyer, Morgan, Selmer, are all good mouthpieces. You need to shop around for a mouthpiece. There are multiflarous tip openings and bore chambers etc that will affect your sound if you choose the wrong one. Have fun! Reply To Post by connsaxman_jim (2336 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax Johnson, I never said that Yanagisawa didn't still make their own horns, but now, ALL Yanagisawa horns that are sold in the United States are distributed through Selmer! That means....SELMER sets the prices! They may not own the company, but they own the US market. Same difference, from my point of view. Reply To Post Yahoo! by johnsonfromwisconsin (767 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax jim, I'm guessing it's not as simple as that. Contracts and agreements that were in place under LeBlanc would naturally transfer under the Selmer Regime until such agreements expire. I doubt this gives Selmer much of any leverage in setting price. Also, Selmer doesn't own the US market, just the old dealer through whom Yanagisawa chooses to do distribution and marketing. Any attempt to tamper with pricing on Selmer's part would also likely instantly meet with a barrage of lawsuits. Reply To Post by simonknight (11 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax Typically the manufacturer controls wholesale pricing in a distribution agreement - supply and demand do the rest. Also, a number of dealers import yanagisawas directly through Europe - that severely limits selmer's ability to control prices in the US market. Reply To Post by rockhard (13 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upfrade to new alto sax Doesn't the Keilwerth SX-90 have a bit of a serious problem, though? I've read so many recommendations on this sax here, but noone seems to have experienced the problem with the "fake" rolled tone holes... Read this review - www.shwoodwind.co.uk/Buying/Keilwerth_sx90r_anniv_alto.htm Is he not right? Am i not getting something? Reply To Post by sax_maniac (984 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upgrade to new alto sax That warning about level tone holes on the R version is a legitimate warning, though I've not ever heard of anyone firsthand dealing with the problem. Frankly, I don't think the soldered rings make enough of a difference to justify the price premium and it does pose a real problem to the tech that has to fix them if that is required down the road. Remember that th SX-90 has regular drawn tone holes - it is the SX-90R that has the extra rings soldered on. Reply To Post by rockhard (13 posts) 19 years ago Re: i want to upgrade to new alto sax Ahh.. That explains it! Reply To Post